Chief Ayo Adebanjo is a veteran politician and former National Chairman of the Alliance for Democracy, AD. He was one of those who agitated for independence. Today, the 85-year-old lawyer-turned politician is full of disappointment over the state of affairs in the country. In this interview with SINA FADARE, the Afenifere chieftain bares his mind on Nigeria at 53, leadership challenge, national conference and the Goodluck Jonathan administration. Excerpts:
How will you assess Nigeria after 53 years of independence?
It is motion without movement. We could have done better, if not for too much of crises in government and all the parties. It is unfortunate for us as a nation. People have been talking about defects in our infrastructure, but my own submission is that the federation we are operating is an awkward federation. Until we settle the nationality problem, there may not be stability. We just have to restructure the country; we must not be a federal state in name and on paper but not in operation.
What is responsible for the state of things?
Everything is about the leadership. It was very sad that the leadership the Peoples Democratic Party, PDP, has provided since 1999 has not been what it should be. The PDP administration has been a disaster, particularly under Olusegun Obasanjo. He had the opportunity to reform the country and put it on a path of glory, but he messed it up. Because of his own ambition to run a third term agenda, le left undone those things that ought to have been done. It is unfortunate for us as a nation. At that stage, we all knew what was wrong with us, but he did not have the courage to do the right thing.
At that time, he could have settled the question of nationality. Since we have been talking about the question of Sovereign National Conference, he is among those people who taunt the notion, that it cannot take place. This is out of misinterpretation of the concept. The sovereignty of the national conference that we are talking about is that of the people; who are the stakeholders in the country, and who will meet at the said conference. That whatever that is decided there cannot be subject to any ratification anywhere or any addition because the people have spoken. It does not affect the incumbent government. So, that whatever we decide there, there is no setting up any committee to review or add anything to it. That is what we call the sovereignty of the people.
It will be a gathering of all the ethnic groups that make up Nigeria which the colonial government amalgamated in 1914. We want to come to a round table to decide that the way we are being ruled is not the best and proffer a credible alternative which will be agreed upon by all and it will be referred to as the voice of Nigerians, not the type which the military forced on us.
We want to live together in peace, but it must be an agreement between us on how we want to live together. It is just a matter that each group will come to the negotiation table and we discuss all our fears, areas of interest, disagreement and at the end of the day reach a consensus on how we would like to be governed. That does not affect or disturb any existing government. People have to shun mischief that the conference will separate the country. We need to come together to discuss all those things that have been causing conflicts.
Some are even ignorant to say that the conference may cause another war. That is nonsense. The nature of our country does not support a unitary system of government, there is too much of centralisation of power in the centre. We have different nationalities, cultures and ways of life; therefore, there should be a forum for us to discuss how we can do something together. All over the world, where the composition of the state is structured like in India, America and the rest, they use the federal system of government to bind themselves together. There is autonomy for the federating states, that is why they have peace.
Even in Belgium, the question of multi-lingua issue is properly addressed. They carried it to their university that they were using two languages. It appears those who take the advantages of what is happening will want to use their positions not to make it effective. Let me say it loud that anybody that is opposed to national conference is an enemy of a united Nigeria.
We know those who are opposed to it, they are mainly from the North, but a few rational among them support the issue of national conference. Therefore, it is a ruse that there will be disintegration. Where have you seen a group of people coming together to decide how they want to better their lots and you say it will lead to war? We want a change, that change that we are clamouring for will give us permanent peace. People say if you make peaceful change impossible, you make violent change inevitable. See the Niger Delta, I don't know what you can do to please them apart from giving them their autonomy.
Today there is crisis in the Niger Delta, tomorrow it is Boko Haram and the next day it is kidnapping. What this is pointing to is the fact that we have been forcefully put together and there is no peace. The only way out of it is to have a dialogue to check all the security problem. Even during the civil war, Ojukwu was insisting that on Aburi Accord he stand. What he was saying was that let us sit down and agree to live together. We should go back to the autonomous state and agree on what we are going to give to the Federal Government.
Will you say the 1914 amalgamation was an error?
There was no doubt that it was a monumental error and great mistake. Along the line, we managed to live together. The only advantage one can point to is our population which we can use to our advantage. To make this a reality, that is why we are saying that we need a dialogue where all the cards will be put on the table and jointly decide which way to go. We want to agree on the condition to live together and the modus operandi. To interpret it otherwise is unfair and mischievous and unpatriotic.
You are a participant at independence in 1960; how do you feel now with the trend of things?
I am not happy at all. As one of the agitators for a self rule, it is disappointing to see that we are still where we are in terms of all-round development. Things were better at independence. We had three regions that were not only autonomous but developing according to their pace. All what you can point to today, are products of that time. After the crisis of 1953, Obafemi Awolowo agitated for a federal state which can accommodate all interests that led to the London Constitution of 1953, which gave autonomy to all the regions
As a result of this, the constitutions of each of the regions were written separately in a federal system that was the condition that we had our independent. The country was handed to us on a federal system. It was the military that restructured Nigeria in 1966; thereafter we fell to this mess. If the progress we made at independence had continued, we will not be where we are today in terms of development. There was competitive rivalry from the leaders of all the regions then. We were criticising ourselves with mouth bullet, but no hatred and wickedness, the type that we are witnessing today.
Those at the helm of affairs today are all rouges. That is why assassination and kidnapping are on the increase. That is why they are fighting virtually everyday. Let me give you an example; what is the cause of the fight in PDP? Do they disagree on the policy to be implemented? No! All they are fighting for is power. The unfortunate thing is that when two elephants fight, it is the grass that suffers. When members of the ruling party is at each other's neck, when are they going to settle down and provide the needed dividends of democracy?
Will you advocate for a unicameral legislature?
Personally, if they will be patriotic enough, there is nothing bad to run the National Assembly on a part-time basis, especially now that the economy is bad. But they kept quiet because majority of them bought their way to power and the party that is supposed to change the system is hesitant because of the benefits they are all enjoining. Imagine when the party itself is conducting primaries to a local government position, and you are requesting for a million.
If that person eventually gets the position, will he not want to recoup his money? That is the cause of the inflated salaries they are paying themselves. That is why we are all paying for the cost of assuming power.
When Jonathan came in, people were complaining about overbloated cabinet and more money going for running cost and virtually nothing for capital project. A lot of panels were set up to look for a way out, but today nothing changed. It is job for the boys.
But the same Jonathan wants to go for a second term?
People are confusing a lot of things together. There is a difference between Jonathan's performance and his second term ambition. Constitutionally, he has every right to contest the election. If people want to criticise him on performance, that is in order. Let the rejection of anybody be decided by the people. We must give equal opportunity for all those who want to rule the country. You can now see how insensitive the people of the North have been. People like Ango Abdullahi saying they want power by all means. That is why this national conference is important. We must sit down and talk on how we want to stay together. You cannot have the unity of the horse and the rider; it is at that conference that we are going to place on the table things that are causing problems within us. We are going to jaw-jaw there, those who are making unreasonable demands we are going to appeal to them, at the end of the day we are going to reach a consensus
Nobody will stand up and say this thing is good for the East, North or the South, no; we are going to agree on which way to go. All the countries that have been forced together, where are they today. Our problem is simple; we are only pretending not to see the hand writing on the wall.
How long do you think we can pretend?
The followership also carry part of the blame, they are the people who accept bribe during election that is why we get the type of leaders that we are having now. The people should go back to the drawing board; we must have a new constitution before 2015 election. This will give us a direction to the future of the country. Next year is the ideal time. We have had 100 years of forced marriage, now we want to renegotiate and see how we can move together again. We can now begin a new life of an agreed unity, not an enforced unity. The amalgamation was an enforced unity.
Nigeria is a big country and we enjoy our size and population which we can use to our advantage. But we cannot enjoy this in a situation where majority are discontented, that is what is causing confusion.
What is your take on the prediction that Nigeria may break up in 2015?
They saw the ominous sign in advance. If we do the right things disintegration will not come in. If we agree that we have a common problem, and we equally agree that this is the way we can solve the problem, that is why we should sit down to discuss it. There is no amount of theoretical framework that can solve this problem unless we address the situation frontally through a dialogue. Let us call the Niger Delta and ask them why they are agitating and what can we do about it, ditto the Boko Haram and those that are kidnapping innocent people. All the stakeholders will put these problems on the table and we would solve it once and for all. You cannot belong to a club where you are being cheated and you will not like to be expunged from a club where you are enjoying a maximum benefit.
Do you think people at the corridors of power are aware of all these fears and uncertainty?
In fairness to Goodluck Jonathan, we met him and he said the government is thinking along that line. I will only implore him to separate himself from the non-conformists. I know a lot of people in government share our dream and aspiration on the issue of national conference, but the fear of unknown keep them off. The logic is that we that are fighting and quarrelling everyday cannot get to a round table and say we want to separate; we have that option on a platter of gold before. It is those of us that are rational that are saying we should put a stop to this problem. It is necessary to resolve this conflict so that we can all have peace.
We should ask ourselves a fundamental question if this country could be ruled under a unitary system of government with this multi-ethnic culture and religion diversity? Or could it be properly governed under a federation? If we answer this question properly and we choose a federal system of government, we should do it holistically without holding anything back. There is no Nigerian factor in practising federalism, it is either you practise it or not. One of the issue that is causing problem is the state police. Did you ever hear a national police in America? Even in Britain there is metropolitan police that belong to the local government.
How will you react to the statement by the northern elders that they were short-changed in terms of allocation accrued to the region?
They are talking nonsense. In the First Republic when we talked about derivation, they agreed at that time that each region should keep 50 per cent of revenue in their domain and the rest 50 per cent to the federal. That was how things were at the independence. While the people of the South-West are enjoining economy from Cocoa, the East, palm kernel and the North, the groundnut pyramid. Everybody was contributing to the federal purse. Now that the oil is coming from the South-South, they did not want them to take 50 percent. How fair is that?
Source: Things were better at independence –Ayo Adebanjo (http://nationalmirroronline.net/new/things-were-better-at-independence-ayo-adebanjo/)